Episode 2-4: The growth trilogy
Episode 2: Infinite growth on a finite planet
After our initial pilot episode, we’re diving straight into one of the many complex themes we plan to explore. First up is the concept of growth, which we’ll devote three episodes and three interviews to. At the end of this trilogy, we’ll share our own reflections on the different perspectives offered by our guests.
If 80% of the world’s energy still comes from fossil fuels, then roughly speaking 80% of the economy runs on fossil energy as well. Which means that at least 80% of the global economy is unsustainable. That part of the economy must, sooner rather than later, be phased out and allowed to die. In short: we need degrowth.
But if 80% of our energy is fossil, that also means that 20% already comes from renewable sources and, to simplify a bit, we can call that portion sustainable. If we’re going to manage the transition to sustainable development, that part needs to grow. In other words, we need sector-specific growth. The same applies to plant-based proteins, advanced recycling technologies, public transport solutions, circular textile systems, and so on. In short: we need a lot of growth.
In debates about growth and growth critique, the focus is of course on growth at the aggregate level growth as the overarching goal of the economy and society at large. It is the system’s external growth that is being questioned. But those of us fighting for a transition must remember that we’re challenging a system built on, and energized by, the very ideas of growth, strength, and dominance. Can we realistically challenge such a system if we only ever emphasize their opposites like regrowth, responsibility and cooperation? Don’t we need the enormous executive power of capitalism to accelerate the transition as fast as possible? Maybe we have to “entice” capital with the prospect of sustainable growth? Or is that exactly the trap, precisely the moment when we end up internalizing, reproducing, and even injecting fresh energy into the mythology of growth?
But what does the alternative look like? A world without growth? Perhaps reasonable for the wealthy parts of the world—but isn’t it outright cynical to advocate a growth freeze for countries south of the Sahara? But on the other hand, is anyone actually advocating for that? And how would we organize and finance a welfare state with a rapidly shrinking tax base if we remove growth from the equation? And even if we had a coherent plan for all of this, how would we sell such a transition to the public and to political leaders? I, for one, do not assume that capital will regulate itself in any meaningful way.
In this series of conversations, we’ll explore the concept of growth from multiple angles to identify possible pathways out of today’s harmful and destructive paradigm. We will speak with Isadora Wronskij from Greenpeace International, and with Anders Wijkman—veteran sustainability leader and former chair of the Club of Rome, among many other roles. But first up is Sam Tidswell, a climate-tech investor focused on regenerative technologies. If Anders and Isadora, in different ways, concentrate on how the system needs to be limited and transformed, Sam works on identifying opportunities within the system to drive necessary change. He is, in essence, trying to harness capitalism’s formidable executional power to secure humanity’s survival or perhaps even to build a world of abundance. With clean energy, a circular economy, and regenerative technologies, do we actually need to limit growth at all?
In the first part of the trilogy, we meet Sam Tidswell, a venture capitalist focusing on cutting-edge technologies, from seaweed-planting robots to biomining and building materials engineered from atoms rather than mined from the earth. Sam not only believes that a regenerative capitalism and infinite growth on a finite planet is possible, he believes it’s something we’re likely to see in the near future.
Episode 1: The pilot
At varius vel pharetra vel turpis
Welcome to the very first episode of the podcast “What is to be done?” with Sasja Beslik, Carolina Sachs, and Joel Lindefors.
In this podcast, we want to explore strategy and tactics for keeping up the highest possible pace in the transition toward a flourishing society on a flourishing planet. Even when the wind seems to be blowing in the opposite direction. But is it really blowing against us? Or is it just noise in the debate?
For a number of years, “sustainable development” was on everyone’s lips. Politicians, business leaders, the mainstream media, researchers, civil society — it felt as if the whole global community, in some sense, agreed that the transition was both necessary and urgent. There was political, financial, and cultural momentum. New directives pushed corporate responsibility forward in radical ways. Companies set ambitious transition targets. Investors expected sustainability to be woven into business strategy. And ordinary people wanted to be part of the change — they bought electric cars and installed solar panels on their roofs.
Now the tone has shifted. Policies are being softened. Targets are being missed. And many people have simply grown tired of all the talk about sustainability. The momentum that once was, seems to have faded. At least, that’s the feeling many sustainability professionals describe today.
But is that really true? Are we actually facing a backlash?
ESG funds still deliver solid returns. Most companies stand by their commitments. And even if the new EU directives — CSRD and CSDDD — have been watered down, they still impose far-reaching responsibilities on more companies than ever before. So perhaps what we’re experiencing is less a structural backlash, and more a communication one — amplified by social media and political rhetoric.
On the other hand, what about actual change?
Are emissions really going down? Not really.
Are human rights improving in global supply chains? No — but then again, they never truly have. For there to be backlash there must be something to backlash from in the first place.
For there to be a reaction, there must first have been progression.
What we can all agree on is this: the transition is moving too slowly.
The political winds are blowing in the wrong direction.
And that leaves us — all of us who recognize the urgency of the situation — with one essential question.
A question that every activist, policymaker, entrepreneur, business leader, investor, consultant, and sustainability professional must ask themselves:
What is to be done?
We know we can’t stay on the current path.
We roughly know what needs to change — but we don’t yet know how.
This podcast takes that question as its starting point.
We’ll talk with people from business, politics, academia, and activism who can help us see new ways forward — people whose experience, perspective, and courage might help us answer that question.
With this podcast, we want to begin mapping out — and inspire others to map out — strategies and action plans for greater speed and force in the transition toward sustainable development.
We ask ourselves, and our guests, the same question:
What is to be done?